[LINK] Weekend Magazine - Remote Siberian Lake Holds Clues to Arctic--and Antarctic--Climate Change

[TKoltai]

(No apologies for top posting… personal attacks should be buried…)

In the following posting there are several http links minus the h.
This is effected so that the posting doesn't go missing into the Link anti-spam filtering system.

Craig,

There ya go with an attempt to close down the debate by attacking the integrity of the poster rather than the facts; 
A common strategy when one is light on with real opposing facts.

Your strategy of making the poster look silly and thereby causing the people to ignore his message is failing.
Here's a news flash. I am silly. Everyone knows it, however history has a weird way of occasionally corroborating my silliness. 
Therefore let us call it Stupidly publicly iconoclastic.

Really Craig, to make me shut up and stop me publishing additional factual counter GW data you really should learn to ignore my posts...

To return to topic, let us examine the Global Warming message:

The sky is falling the sky is falling - let's tax everyone quickly… before it's too late.

with the government solution being…in the words of Dr Walter Starck : 
Quote/ 
Unfortunately, the academics, activists, politicians and bureaucrats leading the push for carbon dioxide taxation and use of renewable energy are non-producers who are woefully ignorant of both the economic reality of productive activity and the practical limits of technology. They are techno-economic-illiterates with a cargo cult understanding of production. Their prescriptions amount to a ritualistic belief that admitting sin (GW) and making an appropriate sacrifice (carbon dioxide taxes) will in some undefined (magical) way bring forth all the right changes, discoveries and implementations that are needed to effect a bright new world of clean endlessly renewable energy with minimal inconvenience to anyone… /Quote

What I think I said in my first posting was:

The best scientists [...] that grant money can buy... Say it's NOT Greenhouse gases alone.

Another example:
Quote/
Recent evidence, however, suggests that we don't know all there is to know about the nearest star. Drs. David Gray (University of Western Ontario) and William Livingston (Kitt Peak) have been studying the Sun's temperature with a technique that compares the strength of absorption lines in the solar spectrum. Gray finds that in addition to a fluctuation of 1.5 degrees Kelvin over the 11-year cycle, the temperature of the sun is steadily increasing by 0.014 degrees/yr.
/Quote
Quote from: Mars Melt Hints at Solar, Not Human, Cause for Warming, Scientist Says on 11/11/11 at 11:11
ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZuQNEcFcm8

And talking about the sky falling... Please point me at a site that can explain why Saturn, and Venus are also increasing their surface temperatures as well.

Ahha... I just figured it out.... Our greenhouse gases are escaping through the hole in the ozone layer and zipping over to our neighbouring planets to squat in cleaner atmospheres… thereby causing massive solar warming and storms on them also… Gee, it's so obvious, I don’t know why I didn't arrive at that conclusion before.

But you are right about one aspect... Scientists need to be funded to be able to survive.
Some take their money from the pro GW warming fraternity and others from the anti (big oil etc.)

On the balance, the question one should be asking, is; would one prefer to believe big oil or Government (keeping in mind that Big Oil is also on the side of Carbon Tax implementation…(wonder why - or could it be that they can pump CO2 into empty oil wells ? - CO2 Sequestration).

When the logic of the question manages to drive you round the bend...
Read some of the links below under References... (placing an "h" at the beginning of each link)

On the other hand if you want really far out kooky... www.youtube.com/watch?v=LicnWDvaA2Y

Or stand outside any evening after 8:00 pm and count how many "shooting stars" you can see WITHIN our ionosphere...

And then please tell me again that Global warming is caused by humans...

Because I am afraid the evidence against global warming is backed by real data over 160 years carried out by real scientists.
Real Scientists say "We're not sure...", "It can't be proven...", There are other unexplained factors...".

The evidence for global warming is based purely on modelled theory with data not available to independent researchers.
That isn't science it's a put up job.
Whatever your individual belief system, when data is made available and has thousands of inaccuracies discovered in it by astronomers, geologists and meteorologists globally, one has to question why certain climatologists (not mentioning any names) need to "alter" historical temperature figures over the last hundred years...

Some cogitation editorial from yesterday's AFR:

Quote/ [ttp://afr.com/p/lifestyle/review/science_held_hostage_in_climate_Uamwgc7zXEsU6RbQJ5MWIJ#]
To the extent that there is such a thing as normal science, it relies upon accurate observations to verify its theories. Accurate is the operative word here. Climate research has to rely on spectacularly inaccurate data from information on Earth’s past climate. Even though there are vast amounts of atmospheric and oceanographic data to play with, together with lots of proxy information from tree rings and ice cores and corals and so on, abstracting a coherent story from it all is something of a statistical nightmare. It gives a whole new meaning to the old saying “lies, damn lies and statistics”.
/Quote

...and for the record... I stand by my post of last month... We are going back into an ice age...

References:
----------------
Magnetosphere ttp://www.swpc.noaa.gov/ace/Mag_swe_24h.gif

South Pole New Temperature Record
June 11th: The temperature of -73.8°C/-100.8°F broke the previous minimum temperature record of -73.3°C/-99.9°F set in 1966.
ttp://amrc.ssec.wisc.edu/news/index.php?id=41

Prikryl, P.; Rusin, V.; & Rybansky, M. (2009). The influence of solar wind on extratropical cyclones – Part 1: Wilcox effect revisited. Annales Geophysicae 27, 1-30. doi:10.5194/angeo-27-1-2009.
ttp://www.ann-geophys.net/27/1/2009/angeo-27-1-2009.pdf

On the Eemian period (125,000 ya) see: ttp://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2005AGUFMPP41B0648K
On MIS 11 (410,000 ya) see ttp://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=%22Marine+Isotope+Stage+11%22
ttp://www.ips.gov.au/HF_Systems/6/9/1 
ttp://www.mcpstars.org/node/353
ttp://www.space.com/11720-monster-saturn-storm-cassini-spacecraft.html

ttp://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2001/ast09feb_1/

TomK 
(now expecting a knock on the door about some other totally unrelated matter. Which of course won’t help me, but will assist you lot.)


> -----Original Message-----
> From: link-bounces at mailman.anu.edu.au 
> [mailto:link-bounces at mailman.anu.edu.au] On Behalf Of Craig Sanders
> Sent: Saturday, 23 June 2012 10:49 AM
> To: link at mailman.anu.edu.au
> Subject: Re: [LINK] Weekend Magazine - Remote Siberian Lake 
> Holds Clues to Arctic--and Antarctic--Climate Change
> 
> 
> On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 10:31:16PM +1000, TKoltai wrote:
> 
> > [...]
> > the best scientists in the world  that grant money can
> > buy say it's not Greenhouse gases.
> 
> what an eye-opening phrase - "the best scientists [...] that 
> grant money can buy". when you put it like that, it's obvious 
> that AGW is nothing but a huge hoax and a fraud.
> 
> it makes perfect sense that there's an enormous secret 
> conspiracy of thousands upon thousands of scientists in 
> pretty nearly every country perpetrating a massive scientific 
> fraud on the world so that they can apply for a few tens of 
> thousands of dollars in grant money. greedy bastards.
> 
> it's obvious. you can't trust scientists, they're such a 
> selfish bunch concerned with nothing but their own profit. 
> all of them. and they all stick together, which is why none 
> of them have blown the whistle on the conspiracy. in any 
> case, the more people involved in a conspiracy, the easier it 
> is to keep it secret. everyone knows that.
> 
> 
> the alternative "theory" that fossil fuel companies with many 
> hundreds of billions of dollars at stake have found a few pet 
> pseudo-scientists to spead FUD in order to prevent or delay 
> any change to Business As Usual is just a kooky conspiracy 
> theory that only an idiot would contemplate.
> 
> craig
> 
> ps: an unrelated matter - i'd like to buy a bridge. do you 
> have any for sale?
> 
> -- 
> craig sanders <cas at taz.net.au> 
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